The Original Dry Bag Steak | Make Artisan Dry Age Steak at Home › Forums › UMAi Dry® Forum Questions › General Questions › Fermentation and Color Change
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jackymltd.
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February 20, 2017 at 6:32 am #2867
murray
MemberI made a 5lb batch of landjager 48 hours ago following the Len Poli recipe. It only calls for 1/8tsp of culture for 2400 g of meat. The marianski book calls for 1/4 tsp per 5000g so this seemed about right. seems like it works out to 0.125g culture per kg meat.
I just noticed however that Umai recommends 1/2 tsp per 2267g(5lb) mixed in 1/2 cup water, thing is that Umai calls a 1/2 tsp 0.5g and Marianski calls a 1/4 tsp 0.6g!! I donthave a scale that can measure 1/10g that accurately so I relied on the tsp measures.I mixed the 1/8 tsp of culture in about 2 tbsp. distilled water and let it stand for 20 minutes or so and added it last after the dextrose, salt, cure and spices.
The problem is that after 48 hours at 21C there is no color change happening. is 1/8tsp not enough culture for 5lbs of meat? should I wait longer? should I pitch the whole batch and start over or just check the ph and not worry about color?
I’m not sure what to do here, but I’m pretty sure if the color was going to change it should have by now? is it still safe if fermentation was less than perfect? How long can I wait before it has to be moved to the fridge – or garbage 🙁
February 20, 2017 at 2:39 pm #10913Jim
MemberWe started out recommending 1/4 tsp for 5 lbs, however we realized that 1/4 tsp even dissolved in water is very difficult to mix in evenly into the meat. Now our instructions say 1/2 tsp. In theory 1/8 tsp may be enough culture, but practically its relatively hard to apply evenly. As for the color change, the culture and fermentation help the color develop, but the real work is done by Instacure that you put into the mix. I would let it go for 72 hours and see if the color brightens.
February 20, 2017 at 3:13 pm #10914MemberThanks Jim.
So if after 72 hours it still hasn’t changed color do you think I should move it to the fridge or start over? Thankfully there’s no ambiguity with respect to the proportions of salt and cure, so if I understand correctly I might be missing out on some of the fermented flavour but otherwise it will still be a safe product once dried appropriately?February 20, 2017 at 3:20 pm #10915MemberThere are of course no guarantees but after 72 hours you should be able to see a color change. If it were me I would still move it to the fridge and see if it will brighten in there. I would let it dry to 40-45% moisture loss and see what it looks like.
The end product should have a little tang to it and look good, if it doesn’t have any tangy flavor, it will not be that good tasting anyway so you would not want to keep it.February 20, 2017 at 4:58 pm #10916MemberThanks again for the quick reply, I appreciate it. I’ll check the ph before moving it to the fridge tonight and see if it gives any indication of fermentation having taken place, maybe I’m just missing the color change because it is so gradual?. I’ll be looking for a ph of 5.3 or less, 5.0 would be even better after 72 hours according to marianski. If its still higher than 5.3 I think I might just start over….
February 20, 2017 at 5:57 pm #10917MemberWell… if you have a reliable way to check Ph you are way ahead of us on this. Keep us updated and if you can post some pics of your creation.
February 21, 2017 at 1:53 pm #10922Bob
MemberIf you checked the starting ph before fermenting it should be around 5.8, from there you can tell how much and how fast it is dropping. 5.3 is ideal for a traditional taste, if you like more tang ferment until 5.0, any lower will inhibit the flavor and color forming bacteria in T-SPX. You may be experiencing more lag time with the small amount of culture added but it should still ferment. Next time start with around 2-3 grams, you really can’t overdose culture.
That being said as long as you are drying at refrigerator temps, I would move them to the fridge after 72 hrs. Ph is the most reliable way to check fermentation but the visual and odor are also good indicators.
If you are reading the Marianski book Ph is only one of the safety hurdles. Ph is more important if drying at traditional temps of 50-58F, as it keeps the bad bacteria at bay until Aw (moisture loss) takes over.
Ultimately the call is yours, personally I would not throw them out.
February 22, 2017 at 12:07 am #10925MemberThanks for the reply. Ive got them in the fridge and they smell good, not off or anything so ill let them run their course. To test the ph I was going to use a ph probe, is there any harm in cutting one of the zip ties off to temporarily gain access?
Some of the casings are loose as the sausages all lost between 19.4% and 21.9% in the first 72 hours (32mm casing) Does that seem like too much? Half the weight loss in the first 3 days or is that normal? The 50mm casings lost about 12.7%.
February 22, 2017 at 12:59 am #10926MemberThe loss of 20% is a bit high for fermentation (3 days) and that may be related to your color change issue. If the sausages were fermenting in a place that had some low humidity or a draft, the outside may have dried out before the fermentation could get to it and change the color. There is no harm in cutting off the zip tie and test ph. This process is pretty forgiving so your product is probably ok.
February 22, 2017 at 3:25 am #10927MemberI definitely struggle with keeping humidity high, its about 36% ambient here right now and I was able to raise it into the 60’s with a humidifier initially but it was all over the place over the three days. I was less concerned about humidity than temperature though, and had no problems holding it at about 21c the whole time. I’ll see how the weight loss goes over the next couple weeks, humidity in my fridge seems to vary from 40-50%.
February 22, 2017 at 3:38 am #10929MemberAs I said the UMAi Dry process is pretty forgiving, so I would guess that the sausage will be ok. Humidity in the fridge is really not that critical.
March 24, 2017 at 1:03 pm #11013MemberI just wanted to close the loop on this thread. The landjager have all lost their required weight, (32mm casing a couple weeks ago), and they turned out fantastic! Its hard to compare using photos, (i’ll try to get some up on photobucket later) but I think the color really deepened as they dried in the fridge.
Subsequent to this batch I used the prescribed amounts of tspx in some soppresetta and chorizo and after 72 hours the soppresetta was almost as red and bright as the chorizo!
So I think I didn’t use enough culture to get the big initial color change the first time, but obviously enough to get the job done because they’re almost all eaten up already!!August 19, 2017 at 11:56 am #11244Aiden
MemberHey mate,
Can I ask how much cure did you use?
September 27, 2017 at 11:22 am #11281Memberquote Jim” post=9150:There are of course no guarantees but after 72 hours you should be able to see a color change. If it were me I would still move it to the fridge and see if it will brighten in there. I would let it dry to 40-45% moisture loss and see what it looks like.
The end product should have a little tang to it and look good, if it doesn’t have any tangy flavor, it will not be that good tasting anyway so you would not want to keep it.Hi mate,
My cured chorizo didnt have a tang but it tastes and smells great. Does it require to have a tang in the taste? Is this an indicator of something?
March 23, 2018 at 10:36 am #11524jackymltd
MemberI mixed the 1/8 tsp of culture in about 2 tbsp. distilled water and let it stand for 20 minutes or so and added it last after the dextrose, salt, cure and spices.
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